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Author Topic: Silas Claiborne Turnbo  (Read 304 times)
deerstalker
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« on: March 15, 2017, 06:05:24 AM »

1844-1925................borrowed from Hoods Smiley

http://thelibrary.org/lochist/turnbo/toc.html#vol11   

http://thelibrary.org/lochist/turnbo/toc.html
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Quill
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« Reply #1 on: March 15, 2017, 08:24:11 AM »

  To bad a person can't benefit from this kind of work while alive. Some good reading there.

 If you read this man's biography you will understand why Social Security was adopted. You can read the same of older ones in James Herriot's books. I learned about how hard it was from family. They knew many that had nothing because they lost everything they owned in financial crashes. Many times they had a bit saved but the bank closed and it was gone.
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Combat-Trout
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« Reply #2 on: March 18, 2017, 11:15:53 PM »

To bad a person can't benefit from this kind of work while alive. Some good reading there.

 If you read this man's biography you will understand why Social Security was adopted. You can read the same of older ones in James Herriot's books. I learned about how hard it was from family. They knew many that had nothing because they lost everything they owned in financial crashes. Many times they had a bit saved but the bank closed and it was gone.

SS isn't going to help they further generations, you know, the ones with two news cars every year, a 50 year mortgage, and $600 in savings...
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"At least once every human should have to run for his life, to teach him that milk does not come from supermarkets, that safety does not come from policemen, that 'news' is not something that happens to other people. He might learn how his ancestors lived and that he himself is no different--in the crunch his life depends on his agility, alertness, and personal resourcefulness." - Robert Heinlein
Quill
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« Reply #3 on: March 19, 2017, 06:01:47 AM »

Not for those people, but not everybody does that. Some drive an old car. Some live in apartments and never own a car. Cherry picking demographics of a small group makes good press  but is not real. If you don't suffer from low wage earnings, good for you but many do. That is why so many pile into cities to earn larger wages. That's what they are expected to do and who wouldn't say if you need higher wages move to where they are. What happens to costs of living in those cities? You can hat Roosevelt all you want to, but you ask anyone that was around before minimum wage and Social Security was made a law life was bad. Would Social Security be as bad off if the government had borrowed 2.7 trillion dollars? Is that 2.7 trillion earning basic interest? No, it's an IOU the government is supposed to pay but cannot do. In the end it will be like all robbed pensions disolved and the people shafted. Cities and states have been doing it right and left with most people's approval. Forget Social Security let's invest in Wallstreet,  what could go wrong? It's not like they would steal or loose it. Let's look at minimum wage, according to the Economic Policy Group if minimum wage had kept pace with labor productivity it would be $18.28 in 2013. Yeah that happened. How would that look next to the average auto workers $29 per hour wage.
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deerstalker
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« Reply #4 on: March 19, 2017, 06:21:17 AM »


Cherry picking demographics of a small group makes good press  but is not real.


True, economics is like the weather..............detail is everything, so many variables.  Smiley
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vector001
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« Reply #5 on: March 19, 2017, 04:52:35 PM »

i never saw an income-free self-reliant type worry about much more than his tomatoes.

vec
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Bill S
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« Reply #6 on: March 19, 2017, 07:04:01 PM »

Yep, but he did worry about his tomatoes and beans and peas and corn and all the rest of his garden.  That was what he was planning to eat come the winter time.

Big difference in worries though, yuppies are worried about keeping in front of the Jones.
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vector001
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« Reply #7 on: March 19, 2017, 08:03:34 PM »

Yep, but he did worry about his tomatoes and beans and peas and corn and all the rest of his garden.  That was what he was planning to eat come the winter time.

Big difference in worries though, yuppies are worried about keeping in front of the Jones.

a good supply of juice jugs and hardware cloth settles most of my worries.....

vec
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Combat-Trout
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« Reply #8 on: March 20, 2017, 02:46:32 PM »

Not for those people, but not everybody does that. Some drive an old car. Some live in apartments and never own a car. Cherry picking demographics of a small group makes good press  but is not real. If you don't suffer from low wage earnings, good for you but many do. That is why so many pile into cities to earn larger wages. That's what they are expected to do and who wouldn't say if you need higher wages move to where they are. What happens to costs of living in those cities? You can hat Roosevelt all you want to, but you ask anyone that was around before minimum wage and Social Security was made a law life was bad. Would Social Security be as bad off if the government had borrowed 2.7 trillion dollars? Is that 2.7 trillion earning basic interest? No, it's an IOU the government is supposed to pay but cannot do. In the end it will be like all robbed pensions disolved and the people shafted. Cities and states have been doing it right and left with most people's approval. Forget Social Security let's invest in Wallstreet,  what could go wrong? It's not like they would steal or loose it. Let's look at minimum wage, according to the Economic Policy Group if minimum wage had kept pace with labor productivity it would be $18.28 in 2013. Yeah that happened. How would that look next to the average auto workers $29 per hour wage.

not everyone, but on average the typical household has less than $5000 in savings, but you can be damn sure they have smartphones, cable, internet, Jordan shoes, eat out and have to see the new releases every week... those one dragging us down are the majority and they have no worries about stealing from anyone, of course they don't see their entitlements as the theft that it is.

My parents were acutely aware of the depression, and nothing infuriated them more than the SS lie...

Minimum wage is a bs thing anyway... and there are a lot of jobs that aren't covered by it, and which minimum wage? Fed, state, local? Private, govt? There isn't just one. And exemptions to it are many.

I had the pleasure of going to the local SS office to help my mom, and do you know how many old people I saw there? 2, the rest were considerably under 50, and all were making claims. As if that wasn't bad enough you can file for claims in dozens of languages...

I would rather trust in a free market where greed drives growth than an fair market that is driven by good willed socialists. Those who do you harm for your own good will never tire, the greedy will at times become bored and look for other things to play with...

I'm not poor, but I'm not rich. I earn what I make and take care of myself and my family. That the "poverty class" can't do the same tells me everything I need to know about them.
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"At least once every human should have to run for his life, to teach him that milk does not come from supermarkets, that safety does not come from policemen, that 'news' is not something that happens to other people. He might learn how his ancestors lived and that he himself is no different--in the crunch his life depends on his agility, alertness, and personal resourcefulness." - Robert Heinlein
Quill
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« Reply #9 on: March 20, 2017, 07:09:12 PM »

There were feelings back and forth on SS. Of course there was BS in the press about it too. Is it the best system no, but a lot of people were saved by it. Many times it was widows. The exceptions to minimum wages were for people who get tips and farm labor. Both are BS excuses so the employers can be cheap. Some states are have higher minimum wage. If there were no basic guidelines most places would be sweat shops. There was a crap storm when Henry Ford went to $5 a day. You can't count on the goodness of your fellow man to give fair wages. Everyone that pays minimum wage would pay half that if it wasn't illegal. Wage BS is popular today. Not long ago, they said auto workers received $75 per hour with benefits. This was gospel even when auto makers themselves said they average $29 per hour. Their  benefits came no where near the extra $45 per hour.
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Dude McLean
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« Reply #10 on: March 20, 2017, 07:54:19 PM »



 my mom and dad told me no one who worked wanted ss they felt they were reduced ... min wage .. that is a false number whatever it is... min wage means they dont have to pay

 you anymore than that..  in the 40s and 50s if you were a worker in the trades , carpenter, painters  etc you made about 12 bucks a day.. the was considered good bucks and on that money people bought homes and cars... etc...went on vacations and fed the family and so on... inflation went nuts an wrecked that model... in 1967 i bought a new pickup cost was 2700 brand new ... had many extras etc... the next year the cost of the same 68 model went o about 4k ... in the 30s a oood hambuger was 5 cents look where that went. i recall my dad and i were out to eat in a nice place and he got the check our steak dinners came to 3 bucks each.. my dad went damn . i said in  all my wisdom of a 13 year old well dad at what they cost he sez to me i used to pay 50 cents for the same meal... inflation... or greed same same.... SS was something the american people did not want... but was shoved down their throats... rewriting history from the time is a shame in our history lies..

  DUDE
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vector001
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« Reply #11 on: March 20, 2017, 08:29:06 PM »

You can't count on the goodness of your fellow man to give fair wages.

conversely, you can't count on the Takers not to form an angry mob either.

minimum wage subdues initiative in workers. it's an economic system that is akin to a third world country, where everyone pulls down the achiever. and that's exactly how they are and anyone who says otherwise hasn't been there.

all these social programs widened the gap between the richest and the poorest.


the Mob does not know what is best for it beyond oxygen, warmth, and caloric intake.

it's an amoeba, that eats countries. you don't want that impulsive beast making policy.

not with it's bottomless stomach and endless reproduction.


when you take care of every widow as a rule, all you get is more widows, cuz you are declaring war on the guy who just wants what he earned, and he is damned more likely to know how to get it back than the Takers.


vec
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deerstalker
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« Reply #12 on: March 21, 2017, 02:38:55 AM »


............the typical household has less than $5000 in savings, but you can be damn sure they have smartphones, cable, internet, ..........


Sounds about right Smiley

IMO............

Presentable clothing, mobile phone, internet access & transport are pretty much essential if you want to find & keep most jobs in the modern world.

Sickness, business failure, family break up, bad debts, property market collapse & many other personal apocalypses can happen to just about anyone but SS is not an answer.

 



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deerstalker
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« Reply #13 on: March 21, 2017, 02:51:25 AM »


the Mob does not know what is best for it beyond oxygen, warmth, and caloric intake.


 
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Quill
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« Reply #14 on: March 21, 2017, 06:07:51 AM »

I don't know what every American thought of Social Security when it came out.  Obviously the one's that I spoke with liked it and they were hard working Americans.  No one liked to see the deduction from the check and if you are self employed,  it's really tough. There was a some that didn't like it until the checks rolled  in. Never heard anyone who didn't like turn it down. Some farmers complained about the tax and then complained it wasn't enough when their checks started coming in. I was brought up to live by the golden rule and look after widows and orphans. God's will and all. I don't mind a certain amount of welfare for those truly in need. The abusers are the problem. Abusers are the bane of everything. And there are plenty. They take what isn't theirs, have no care for their fellow human. Even in smaller things their way is the only way. You don't like it tough. I don't fully agree with all my local taxes, I do realize there has to be taxes. Even the founding fathers did. Some I know think not. Yet they want police, fire departments, sewage,  water, garbage pickup. They seem to think those funds just fall from the sky. When it comes down to it they are indoctrinated by large businesses that are always complaining about taxes and many times it's a party line idea. By the way a large amount of those businesses live off government contracts and are not above wasting that money. Many of the individuals that complain work government jobs or work in industry, that is mostly funded by the government so taxes ultimately pay their wages.

As to minimum wage, there should be no need for for it. Still businesses get away with it because people want cheap. If it can't be made cheap here, they go to other countries. They don't even want to pay US minimum wage. Not enough profit. Me I wouldn't waste my time with that kind of work. It's a pathetic insult to a worker. It's an insult that it's needed and the the amount offered is an insult.
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